SPACES OF ENUNCIABILITY: De-ritualized Dialogues in Contemporary Context, an Interview with Igor Grubic

Grubic’s public space interventions, as well as films, explore political situations in both the past and the present. Grubić’s critical, socio-politically engaged practice is characterized by long-term involvement and commitment to the issues he decides to address. From profound research of the fate of historical monuments and the collapse of industry, to examining the difficulties of minority communities, his projects are implemented over the course of several years of research and establishing special relationships.

Grubic has exhibited widely, participating in the Venice, Gwangju, Istanbul, Thessaloniki, Yerevan  Biennales; MoMA, New York; Tate Modern, London; Palais de Tokyo, Paris; MuMOK, Vienna; MAMbo, Bologna; MAXXI, Rome; MSU Museum of Contemporary Art, Zagreb, among others.

Kisito Assangni (KA): Many contemporary artists see the aesthetic as a social and artistic construct where the shapes represent an emotion in innovative ways. What is aesthetic to you?

Igor Grubic :Yes, aesthetics is just one of the ways to express thoughts and emotions… In my work, I start from the principle that there is no aesthetics without ethics. Every thought, word, gesture, and action contribute in shaping our reality. The goal and mission is to implement this practice in all my actions, both private or artistic. There should be a responsibility in each act to shape the reality we live in.

KA : Given your extensive exhibition history, what processes have to be carried out for viewers to understand that an art object represents a feeling, a phenomenon or a concept?

IG: Education in schools from a young age is crucial, and that is why people should be encouraged to develop creative and critical thinking through learning, creativity, and interaction with art. It is important to understand the context in which a work was created to be able to understand the artist's intention.

Exhibitions should ideally provide a written explanation, or a brief artistic statement alongside the work, helping viewers understand the context from which the artist and the artwork emerged, and how the techniques and media are used to convey certain ideas.

Do Animals go to Heaven, 2017, Igor Grubic 

KA: Is there an artwork of yours that stands out in this moment as being particularly meaningful to you? Relating to the above, what does it mean to you to be authentic as an artist?

IG: My art practice has always been a mirror of society, starting from the post-war mid-90s to now – from Black Peristyle to Small Acts of Power – my works reflect a desire to intervene in reality, to express a political stance through visual means. It is difficult for me to single out any work in particular, but perhaps the most memorable experiences, in terms of personal growth and empowerment, were the first few actions with which I managed to cause a strong response in the public and achieve real, concrete changes. Actions from the nineties such as Black Peristyle, Book and Society 22% – protests against the tax on books or, for example, the action for the removal of the management of the Student Center, as well as some later actions, really brought about the changes I advocated for. The power of that experience was extremely encouraging for my furtherwork and belief in the potential of art.

Being authentic means speaking from lived experience. At the beginning of the nineties, I was shocked by the horrors of war, near-death experiences, and cruelty, as well as by the fact that former good neighbors turned into beasts overnight. That trauma led to a personal identity crisis prompting my own spiritual exploration and spiritual revolution, a kind of struggle that continues to this day because it requires careful daily self observation. Reacting to personal war trauma and questioning my responsibility for shaping the reality we live in, I chose to treat art as my method of struggle.

Another Green World, 2021, Igor Grubic

KA: From your perspective, what is the importance of art collecting? Is contemporary art open to the masses?

IG: I hope it is, since art is a thermometer of an epoch, whether it pertains to high, traditional, mass, or alternative culture.

Collections, as a medium, can help distribute artists' ideas. They can contribute in initiating dialogue, inspiring, motivating, and educating the public. Collections in both private and public institutions provide the public with a critical perspective on reality.

KA: What are you currently interested in and how does it feed into your creative thinking?

IG: In these challenging times surrounded with wars, suffering of innocent people, economic crises, environmental pollution, and natural disasters, it is difficult to remain an optimist.

But despite this, we need to fight, build faith, and foster utopian idealism among young people, who will use these means to create a better future. That utopian horizon of freedom is what every conscious being dreams of – a society focused on developing the creativity, solidarity and spiritual potential of everyone. It is the foundation of my identity. I want to be part of a community that strives to live a life with spiritual values ​​and that shares utopian idealism. A kind of cultural brotherhood that unites free, lofty ideas of community, fighting for freedom and equality, care for others, preoccupation with intangible, beautiful, virtuous values, the desire to create a positive environment... Thus, this series of small shifts in consciousness, when multiplied, can push society forward towards spiritual development.

Small Acts of Power, 2022-2023, Igor Grubic

KA: In recent times, conjunctural artistic manifestations are everywhere: there is activist art to combat climate change, collective art to solve social problems, political art to reflect on the discomforts of society. What is your position around these examples? Do you have any moral or ethical responsibilities in your works?

IG: Ethics is the principle of any responsible action in society, and my way of doing this is through art. In my practice, ethics and aesthetics are simply inseparable, they are two sides of the same coin. In this sense, I am not interested in doing art as mere decoration or entertainment. "An artist who cannot live what s/he preaches is not an artist" is a statement, part of the performance I realized at MSU Zagreb in 2020, and it sums up my attitude. This way of living and acting originates from my personal war trauma, when I began to question my responsibility for shaping the reality in which we live. 

Non-political art doesn't really exist because any artistic expression, even a simple thought, can only be a political gesture and must reflect the responsibility the artist has towards society. For Chantal Mouffe, all art is political because it changes or maintains the symbolic structure of society. In relation to political art, critical art is "art that foments dissensus, that makes visible what the dominant consensus tends to obscure and obliterate“. It is up to the artist to choose whether to obey the dictates of capital and affirm the existing power relations or to advocate, through critical action and build utopian horizons. In both cases, it is a political act.

KA: The influence of artificial intelligence (AI) on creativity and productivity is a controversial topic in the art world. Have you experimented with AI art? How do you see AI impacting the life of artists and the creative process?

IG: Honestly I am still quite distant from AI. I am aware that it is already integrated into our daily lives, but it hasn’t influenced my artistic approach yet. I am deeply connected to the society and to the body, both personal and collective, that I have in some way the presumption to believe that I do not need it. On the other hand, I think that AI can be considered a mere tool, outside of the creative process, it can be more helpful than dangerous for humans in general.

Currently, the easy availability of artificial intelligence (AI) creative tools has emerged as a new challenge. However, the point is to extract the maximum creative potential from the author, which raises questions about how, for what purpose, and to what extent will AI tools be used. It is important that the use's (human')s potential is not put to sleep, or made passive.

My principles and experience are that I work with modest means and that in such challenging circumstances I strive to achieve maximum effect. This forces me to use my imagination as much as possible, and at the same time I point out that absolutely anyone can use minimal artistic means, if they realize it, because we all have hidden creative potential. Everyone has their own path and process to enlightenment, and this can only be done through active and persistent action, never passively. Art is one of the tools that can help us in the process of discovering and getting to know ourselves. When using artificial intelligence in the near future, it all depends on whether we approach it wisely enough, with a healthy dose of self awareness.

KA: French thinker Jacques Rancière wrote "When artists adopt other guises or disciplines, are there alternative models of criticism or classification to which we should turn? " How does this resonate with you?

IG: We live in an era in which strict classifications can no longer exist. Disciplines are interconnected, and it makes no sense to talk about art as separate from history, society, etc. The artist as anthropologist, the artist as archaeologist, the artist as scientist – and I could go on and on with every different category. So yes, I think that the criticism should follow the same attitude of blending the disciplines and observing art from different perspectives.

KA: Any future projects?

IG: I am currently working on a new film related to animal rights, which is a topic I have been developing for the last 10 years. I have been a vegetarian for almost 30 years, and in the new project, I remain consistent with a similar approach as in the film Ingresso animali vivi. That project deals with the topic of dehumanization, exploring animal rights. The core of the new short film is an interview with a man who worked in a slaughterhouse, which he experienced as a horrific, difficult, and painful experience, and who, motivated by that trauma, became an advocate for animal rights.

The film is not only an illustration of the interviewee's testimony, but seeks to express emotion – the experience of horror tied to the cruel, inhumane reality of the meat industry. I believe that in the 21st century, we really have a great opportunity to choose the way we eat and live.

Main Image: Angels with Dirty Faces, 2004-2006, Igor Grubic